Calif. May Still Recognize Marriages if Prop. 8 Passes

California is still counting upwards of 4 million absentee and provisional ballots to determine the outcome of Proposition 8, but marriages performed over the past 5 months may still be honored if it passes.

California Attorney General Jerry Brown said that the 18,000 same-sex marriages performed in California between June 16 and November 4 will still be recognized as marriages.

"I believe that marriages that have been entered into subsequent to the May 15 Supreme Court opinion will be recognized by the California Supreme Court," Brown told the San Francisco Chronicle in August. He also said that the outcome of Proposition 8 would likely only apply to future marriages.

The ballot initiative's language does not mention revoking marriage recognition from those couples. The National Center for Lesbian Rights and Lambda Legal warn, however, that Proposition 8 proponents might file a lawsuit to invalidate those marriages.

Comments

[Lin]

I have spent my entire life with Christan thinking being pushed in my face as a jewish child, now mormans want to tell me I cant marry the one I love. Why are the religious beliefs of a group allowed to dictate anything....what happened to seperation of church and state. We cant pray in our schools, but we can allow religious perferences of one group to be be pushed on all?

[Steven]

To Adrianne: the weakness in the African American position I was referring to was the claim to support civil rights for all and the unwillingness to extend this to LGBTQ citizens. I hope we can agree that marriage IS a civil right and that one of the key demands of the African American civil rights movement was the repeal of the deeply offensive miscegenation laws. To then deny these same rights to others seems like a very flawed position to me.

Having re-read my comments and yours however, I think I see what you object to. I should have said "a common African American position". I do understand that African Americans don't vote as a bloc on issues any more than Whites or Latinos or any other group. We agree that homophobia does exist amongst African Americans and needs to be dealt with, but I didn't mean to imply that it was universal.

I realise that my "exposition" of African American homophobia is nothing new. I don't claim authorship of this idea. My intention was to put it on the table as a viable explanation of the overall African American vote without ever claiming intellectual property rights over the whole concept.

Perhaps even more important than clearing up that particular misunderstanding is to explain why I felt you might accuse me of racism.

I found some of the language in your original comment unacceptable in the context of this kind of debate. This all started with Robert's implication that African Americans are our enemies and although that's an inflammatory and simplistic reaction to a complex situation, we don't know Robert or understand on what conscious level he engages with these issues. I started reading your reply thinking it was a measured response, but your very pertinent arguments got lost in the midst of "all Whites are racist" rhetoric. I don't mean to say that this is what you believe but "throw a bone to the darkies" is the language of confrontation, not reasoned response.

I've had several discussions with African Americans who have implied, if not openly stated, that Whites are intrinsically racist and I object to this idea very strongly. Of course I know that many, maybe most African Americans don't feel this way and it appears that in the light of your subsequent comments, you don't either. Your original language made me suspect you might. For this I apologise.

Finally your comments about needing straight allies and allies of colour in our struggle is interesting. I'm assuming you're straight. While I agree that your support is helpful and would encourage you to continue giving it (because I for one DO appreciate it), this IS an LGBTQ issue and needs to be spearheaded by LGBTQ citizens. You can do valuable work in dealing with homophobia in your own community but at the end of the day, we'll only get marriage equality if we fight for it ourselves.

Doesn't mean you can't fluster a nun next time you see one, though. Now who's being inflammatory??

[Alan A. Katz]

No one can believe that African-Americans single-handedly wrought the damage of Prop 8.

But that's not the issue for me. That 70% of an opressed electorate, on the same day they overcame that opression to see a representative of their race ascend to the highest office in the land, voted to deny us our rights is profoundly unsettling and disappointing to me. I do have many black friends and associates, I was raised in the Civil Rights movement of the 1960's and I deeply appreciate their suffering and long-standing discrimination.

But that's what I don't get. I am a member of one of the oldest opressed people (I'm Jewish) and, in a large part due to that heritage, I was (and am) a rabid supporter of the Civil Rights movement. Coming from an opressed people, I had great empathy for other opressed people, and I understood, at a gut level, that discrimination against anyone is discrimination against all of us.

And so, the A-A response to Prop 8, whether it was responsible for the passage of this onerous proposition or not, is totally incomprehensible to me. It strikes me as being incredibly hypocritical and hard-hearted, no matter what one's religious inclinations may be.

And it is so very sad, for us, and for them. I cannot even imagine the hatred and disparagement gay African-Americans must suffer both at the hands of their own community, and the greater community at large.

The numbers don't matter. It's the hate that outlasts the polls.

[Tina]

What do YOUR RELIGIOUS BELIEFS have to do with the laws and my civil right to marry?

I'll tell you, NOTHING. Separation of church and state means you cannot force your religious beliefs on others or discriminate against others who believe differently than you!

STOP SHOUTING AND LISTEN FOR A WHILE. THIS IS ABOUT TAKING AWAY PEOPLE'S FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS. SHALL I VOTE ON YOUR MARRIAGE?

[Jeff in Los Angeles]

I keep reading that the word "marriage" is the only thing stopping us from having equal rights. Forgive me if I don't believe it when I hear all the people who voted for Prop 8 would otherwise not care if we have only civil unions.

I used to think it would be okay to be "civil unioned" to my spouse. Now, I don't think I should be asked to accept anything less than any other American citizen.